(upbeat music) (projector clicking) - Have you ever wondered where the television signal you're watching is coming from?

♪ I love to go a wanderin' (projector clicking) ♪ along the mountain track - Welcome to True North.

(upbeat music) (mysterious music) - Good evening and welcome to Mainewatch (upbeat music) (projector clicking) Welcome to From the Vault, a celebration of 60 years of Maine Public Television.

Well, baseball season is underway.

So we thought we would stay in that theme and find something baseball related.

What we are going to do is go back to 1992 for an episode of Woods and Waters with Bud Leavitt.

In this episode the famed sportsman spends an hour with former Red Sox and Expos pitcher Bill Lee.

Now, we've shown parts of this episode before, but this time we will bring you the entire hour long conversation where they take phone calls from viewers around Maine and Atlantic Canada.

Now, Bud did pass away just a couple of years after this episode.

But Bill is still going strong at the age of 75.

In fact, he is still pitching as a member of the Savannah Bananas, that crazy Georgia team known for Banana Ball a blend of baseball and entertainment that sees players on stilts playing in kilts, dancing umpires and grannies.

A reminder that we have several entire Woods and Waters episodes available on our From the Vault playlist at YouTube.com/mainepublic.

Now let's talk baseball as we go back to 1992 for Woods and Waters.

(soft music) ♪ I love to go a-wandering along the mountain track ♪ ♪ And as I go I love to sing ♪ My knapsack on my back ♪ Val-deri, Val-dera ♪ Val-deri, Val-dera, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha ♪ ♪ Val-dera ♪ My knapsack on my back (bright instrumental music, "The Happy Wanderer") - [Announcer] Woods & Waters with your host, Bud Leavitt.

- I suppose I could start this program this evening by reading from the Baseball Encyclopedia.

I'm not going to do that.

Nor Fenway by Peter Golenbock.

Why?

William Francis Lee, he saw through both of these books, but he's here live and in person.

Bill Lee, good to see you.

- Thank you, Bud.

Nice state you got here.

- Pretty good state.

- Yeah, it's pretty.

- How about the provinces?

- The provinces are nice.

I got to play there for five years in Moncton and ended up in Sydney Mines almost, and then-- - [Bud] Sydney Mines.

- Yeah, I ended up play up there.

- Anybody ever hear of Bill Lee at Sydney Mines?

- They know about me now.

- Really?

- Hit a long home run into a project over there in Waterford, I think it was.

Then they, I had a good time there.

I enjoyed my days in the Maritimes.

- Did you enjoy your days in the big leagues?

- They went by awful fast.

I enjoyed 'em, I enjoyed 'em all.

Even the time when I got banished to Montreal and found out that bars stayed open till four o'clock.

(chuckles) The Red Sox sure know how to punish a guy like me, an Irish Catholic.

- [Bud] Huh?

- We'll send him up there to La Belle Province, let's see him take a little of that.

- But you had a great year up there in Montreal.

- I had a great year.

I ran to the ball park, I had to sober up some way.

I won 16 games, and we were one game away from first place.

And the Red Sox were mired in the Second Division.

And then my next year in Montreal, we were one game away from first place.

And then the last year in Montreal, we were one game away from first place.

We felt a lot like Linus in the Snoopy cartoon.

We were Charlie Brown.

We never seemed to win it up there.

We were bridesmaids.

But the Canadians really liked us because we had a lotta heart, that team in Montreal, and they loved us.

But out here in the Maritimes, there were more Red Sox fans than there were Expo fans.

And I couldn't figure that out.

I just didn't know, but it shows the tradition, the New England tradition, extends all the way up the coast, all the way through St. John, Moncton, Charlottetown.

You know, all the way over to Hucksberry.

- What is it about the Maritimes that had fascinated you so much?

- It seemed to have been like America was a long time ago.

It was slow paced, it was easygoing.

People were friendly.

When you stopped by at a person's house, they invited you in.

They fed you, they kept you there.

They told you stories.

And there was no rush or pace to it.

And it was a...

I needed that after my days in Montreal, which were very hectic and under the microscope.

And my days in Boston, I thought I was a mature old adult when I was in Boston.

And I didn't realize that I wasn't even mature in Moncton, but I'm not mature now, but I'm getting there.

You know, my hair's getting grayer, and I better gain maturity soon or life may pass me by, but I've had a good time.

- Your 10 years in Boston, three of those years, you won 17 ball games.

You know I'm gonna ask you this question.

Who was the best manager you ever played for?

- Rod Dato at the University of Southern California.

- Oh, come on, I mean the big leagues.

- Well, we one it that all year, College World Series.

The best manager I had in the big leagues was Dick Williams.

Without a doubt.

- [Bud] This was a mean, tough guy.

- But he knew baseball and I respected him.

He knew the game, he had no favorites.

He didn't play a favorite.

He played the game the same way, day one as day...

If you got on his list, you got off his list if you did well the next time out.

He didn't keep you on it.

Zimmer had a doghouse, and as Ferguson Jenkins said-- - [Bud] That's manager, Don Zimmer.

- Yeah, Zim had a doghouse.

And the only problem with his doghouse, it didn't have a door on it, you know.

(chuckles) And it's true, the statistics, we were just talking about that.

In Montreal, I was 10 and six, lost four games in a row.

And Dick Williams stuck with me.

I ended up winning my last six.

I ended up 16 and 10, and we missed the world series by one game, to Pittsburgh.

In '78 with the Red Socks, I was 10 and six.

They got rid of Carbo, I was upset.

I lost four games in a row.

Zimmer said, "We'll win it without Lee."

They brought up Sprowl.

Threw me in the bullpen never to be seen again.

And I ended up with a 10 and 10 record, you know?

All he had to do was keep me in the rotation, I would've won my last six and we'd blow the Yankees away, going away.

And we're the world champions, and Reggie Jackson doesn't hit the three home runs against the Dodgers.

And he's a jerk anyway, he didn't deserve to hit it.

You know, he wouldn't have made the hall of fame, and it would've changed the world.

We'd have world peace right now.

We wouldn't have the war in the Gulf.

Gosh, just because of Zimmer.

- What got between you and Zimmer?

- Ooh, he's a hitter, I'm a pitcher.

- You mean he disliked pitchers?

- I'll tell you a story.

We're playing in Seattle, and all of a sudden on the wire, it says, "Garvey and Don Sutton get into a knockout brawl "at Donnybrook."

And Zimmer's gone, I can't believe that.

Sutton's a nice guy.

Garvey's a sweetheart, he's the nicest guy in the world.

How could those two get in a fight?

I looked at Zimmer.

I said, "One's a hitter and one's a pitcher.

"The twain shall never meet."

And he goes, "What do you mean, what do you mean?"

You know, like this.

And he just walks away.

And I should have never used the twain, that word confused him.

(laughs) But you have to see it.

Like we said before, the last person that ever got Zimmer out in a ball game was Jim Kaat threw him a three-two backdoor curve ball, when he was with the Washington Senators.

He took it for called third strike, into the ball game.

The pennant went to Minnesota, and Zimmer never played again in a Major League ball game.

He hates pitchers.

He'll always hate pitchers, even though he has to manage them, deep down inside, middle infielders that hit less than .250, made too many outs, they don't like pitchers.

Deep down inside, in their psyche, they hate pitchers.

- Yeah, but you called him a name that became famous.

You made a rodent famous.

- I made it, well, I called Billy Martin a no good dirty rat because he let his daughter rot in a Peruvian jail.

I said, Zimmer.

They said, "Well, what's Zimmer?

"If he's a rat, what's Zimmer?"

I said, "Well, he's fat, got big puffy cheeks.

"He's a gerbil."

And the kids, a kid wrote me a letter.

He says, "Mr. Lee, I think you're mistaken."

He says, "A gerbil's a very thin creature with long legs.

"A hamster has the big puffy cheeks."

And I'm sorry, I'll say this right now, Zim.

I'm sorry, you're a hamster.

(chuckles) But that's a lovable, affectionate term.

It was not used in a derogatory sense.

It was used in a connotation of rodents.

I was talking.

If we were talking hawks, I would've called...

I would've called.

(laughs) Let's not get into that one.

I would've called Billy Martin a shrike or something that would lay his eggs in another bird's nest and kick out the young and beat 'em to death with a mallet.

And they said, "Well, what's Don Zimmer?"

I said, "Well, he's fat.

"He's got big puffy cheeks.

"He's a hoot owl, right?"

You had to be there.

- Oh, when you go back to the ballpark now, do you and Zim speak?

- I went there the other day, well, a month ago, and Zim saw me and immediately took a fungo bat and walked to center field and stood out there with his arms crossed.

And until I left, he would not come back into the playing field.

I should have stayed there the whole game.

Would have like to seen him standing next to Burks.

(laughs) Would've been better than coaching third.

Too many men on the field.

No, I... You can see, I make levity of everything, but.

- I know you make levity of everything.

And at one time during your career, you sent the Boston writers looking over the state of Maine map.

You absented yourself from Fenway Park and said you had gone to the alagash.

- [Bill] That's right, I wish I had have.

- They didn't know where the, where'd you go?

- I know, they figured the alagash.

- [Bud] They never knew where the alagash was.

- Well, they-- - I had Boston baseball writers calling me wanting to know where the hell-- - Oh, I bet you they thought I was up with you.

I should have been.

That was a, what a nice place the alagash, you know.

- [Bud] Well, tell me, where did you go during that, when you absented yourself?

- I went, I was in my house over in Belmont.

The press finally found me and they demanded that I come out of the house and they film me, and I gave it my power salute to Bernie Carbo.

And they, then Don Zimmer saw me and Haywood Sullivan.

And they sent me a telegram to my house saying, "You better get back to Fenway Park "or we're gonna take desperate action," and stuff like that.

So I got on my army fatigues, I ran to the ballpark.

I ran six miles to the ballpark.

I came into Haywood Sullivan's office and I said, "Yeah, Haywood, what do you want?"

And he says, "Well, you walked out on the ball club.

"You jumped the ball club."

I said, "You sold one of your children "to Cleveland for half the waiver price."

He says, "You don't make policy, we make policy.

"You're not running this ball club."

And he says, "We're gonna fine you $500."

And I said, "Haywood."

I said, "Why don't you fine me 1500 "and give me the weekend off?"

(Bud laughs) He really liked me then.

- I bet he liked you.

- Then they take me down and Zim makes fun of me in front of all the players, saying this guy's got no respect for the Red Sox uniform.

He hates you guys.

He jumped the ball club.

And I went down and I said, "Yeah, and where's Bernie Carbo?"

I said, "You're gonna miss Bernie Carbo."

I said, "You're gonna miss this day till the day you die."

And what happened in that year?

Not one Red Sox pitch hitter drove in a run after Bernie Carbo left.

Bob Bailey was up against Gossage in the last game.

And Carbo could have come in and pitch hit for him.

He could have made a switch right there.

And you look back at the records, we did not... Eh, it's in the book.

That's all I can say, you can look it up.

And that was the '78 season, and I was sold or traded on December, December 7th, a day that will live in infamy with all Red Sox fans.

- (laughs) You had four teeth knocked out.

- I had four teeth knocked out four different times.

- [Bud] Now, who did this?

- First time, the sidewalk.

Second time, my brother's baseball helmet.

Third time, Elio Rodriguez's brother and his cousin and a steel pole.

The fourth time, a guy's shoulder in a basketball game.

The fifth time I was driving Melissa on her bike and she put her feet in the spokes, and I went over and lost my teeth on the sidewalk, but I didn't fumble the girl.

- But tell me about Elio Rodriguez.

He was a pretty good battler.

- Elio Rodriguez.

I was in Mayaguez pitching, and I hit, I gave up a three-run homer to Willie Montanez.

Willie Montanez hit it.

Next hitter up was Rodriguez.

I drilled Rodriguez right in the hip, intentionally.

Hit him with a slider, not a fast ball 'cause my fast ball doesn't hurt.

So I hit him with a slider, and he charged the mound.

And when he got to the mound, I stayed on the rubber like you're supposed to do.

Stay on the rubber, hold up your glove.

And I hit him with a left hook that Cal Ermer says was one of the best left hooks he'd ever seen.

I knock Rodriguez out.

Next day in the papers it says, "Mayaguez loses but Lee, El Lancer, Zordo."

He says, "puncharon, el former light heavyweight "golden glove champ, Elio Rodriguez."

So here I am, I knock out the number one light heavyweight in the state of Puerto Rico, or the province or the dominion or whatever it is.

So they jumped me the next day in Caguas and beat me within an inch of my life.

- Where were you, getting off a bus?

- Got off a bus.

It was a weird situation.

The bus got bogged down and then the bus lurched forward.

And I had an avenue amongst all these people.

And they said, "Take it, Bill."

I took it, and I took it and then I got surrounded, and I got pushed into a steel pole.

So I was brave to get off the bus first and dumb.

I should have got off later, but then I might have died.

- But you hit him again with another pitch.

- I hit him in Boston the following year.

Hit him with a slider right in the same hip.

And he charged the mound, and Montgomery pulled him.

No fight, we didn't get expelled or anything.

And then he went to first base and then I faked home, picked him off at first base and-- - [Bud] Oh, you picked him off.

- I picked him off for the second out of the inning.

He came back in, and he was putting on his uniform, his pads, and I threw a change up to the next hitter down and in.

And he got out in front and hit a line drive into the Brewers dugout and hit Rodriguez right in the chest.

And I said, "One of my better pitches."

- [Bud] Do you get a Christmas card from him annually?

- No, he's...

I talk to a lot of guys, Felix Millan, friends of mine, Cayo Cruz.

You know, people that I know in Puerto Rico.

And they say that Elio Rodriguez is a bad hombre.

He's loony tunes.

I was crazy, but he was nuts.

- Listen, before we start taking telephone calls from our viewers out there, tell me about the New England Gray Sox?

- Well, thank you.

It's a... We had a senior league down in Florida, which folded because we charged too much for the fans.

It was overpriced.

It was the wrong time of the year.

And the owner of the team, Jim Rusic, liked the idea of having all Red Sox together.

I was the general manager, and I said, "Get all Red Sox."

I says, "You can market it well in New England.

"People love to see the old Red Sox players."

So we decided last year, we played two games in Connecticut and 6,000 fans came to see McAuliffe, me, Fidritt, Stanley, Bill Buckner, and Dalton Jones played third.

And I had a, we couldn't get a catcher, ex Red Sox catcher.

I probably could get Haywood Sullivan's son.

- Mark.

- Mark.

But I got Ozzie Virgil Jr., he catches for us.

George Foster, who is not a Red Sox, but he's a New England boy, plays the outfield.

And he's a friend of mine.

And we had Bobby Bonds play one game, but he's not gonna play anymore because he doesn't wanna play.

So we're getting old Red Sox players, and we are touring New England like summer stock theater.

And we're playing a game in, first one in Nashua, New Hampshire, Pittsfield, Massachusetts, Lynn.

And after Lynn on Wednesday, we're driving up and we're gonna spend three days in the Bangor area.

We're gonna play on Stephen King's field, and we're gonna play a collegiate all-star team over at Orono.

- At the university.

- At the university.

We're gonna play an elite team, and we'll probably get beat because we're gonna be tired.

Slow.

Nah, we haven't... We beat the number one champs in New England hardball 13 to one last year and seven to one.

We've only given up two runs.

Stanley still throws extremely well.

I threw well last year, I had four bone chips out.

But the New England Gray Sox, we go around.

We raise money for local charities.

Each ball game, we donate part of the ticket price to the charity.

So we're funding amateur baseball in Pittsfield.

We're funding the challenger league of handicap players in the Lynn area.

And we haven't picked out a charity for Nashua.

In Burlington, Vermont, we're raising money for the Long Trail.

Long Trail Ale is giving us all of their beer, and we're selling it all over the ballpark.

And the money goes to securing the Long Trail.

So people can hike for free on one of the most beautiful trails.

Part of the Northern extension of the Appalachian trail.

And we haven't decided what we were gonna do here.

You know, Stephen King is-- - Briefly, what are you doing with your time these days outside of this little baseball skirmish?

- I'm going to Boston tomorrow.

I'm playing four ball games over the weekend, charity ball games.

I am running for President under the Rhinoceros ticket.

I think I can really throw a scare into H. Ross Perot.

- Well, the way things are going right now, you might win.

- I started that.

Perot's just taking, he's plagiarizing my platform.

You know, and I, besides that, I'm doing that.

I built my own house.

I plant a lot of apple trees this spring.

And I'm just a Johnny Appleseed.

I just, people call me up and I come, and that's the way I've always run my life.

And I don't expect to change.

And I would love the New England Nissan dealership to give me free mileage because I've got 72,000 miles on my Pathfinder and it's a year old.

- Wow.

- I can book.

- Well, the other day when I talked to the house, you were in San Francisco, and you've been really everyday, to date.

- Everyday, I've got one weekend free, and that's taken up 'cause I'm coming up on July 4th, and I'm playing against Stephen King's All-stars.

And he challenged me to a ball game, and I accept all challenges, and I'm gonna come-- - [Bud] So you're gonna go pick on the town's leading author.

- Yeah, I'm not gonna hit him.

- [Bud] Oh, you're not gonna hit him.

- No, I don't drill people.

I just throw 'em change ups and little garbage.

I do my Mike Quair imitation.

Here's a cauliflower, you know, here's a cabbage.

You can't hit a cabbage far, you know?

(laughs) - All right, we'll take your calls now anytime.

Are we ready?

All right, yell when you're ready.

You mentioned Dick Williams.

You're one of the few people supportive of Dick Williams.

He's been admitted to be a great manager, but he's tough.

- He's tough.

You have to be tough to be a good manager these days.

You cannot cater to everybody's little whim.

You know, in the old days, it used to be 25 different individuals trying to satisfy one man.

Now you have one man trying to satisfy 24 different individuals, all riding in different limousines.

You cannot do that and have a good ball club.

You have to have the cohesiveness, the respect, that is gained by the guy in Pittsburgh, the guy in Minnesota, the guy in Oakland, you know.

And the guy in Toronto must command a lot of respect too.

I don't know.

They're good manager.

I'm not saying Butch Hobson isn't a good manager.

He's too young, he hasn't paid his dues in the managerial scene.

The Red Sox brought him up too much.

Plus everybody liked Joe Morgan.

Joe Morgan did nothing wrong.

He won more ball games than any other Red Sox manager.

He took a club that was notoriously slow and snuck 'em through the back door, you know?

And they almost beat Toronto.

They shouldn't have been in the same ballpark.

They can't play on AstroTurf.

They can't play in big ballparks.

- Did you ever hear of Molunkus?

- [Bill] Molunkus, no.

- Yes, well, you're gonna talk to a man from Molunkus right now, come in.

- [Ed] Yes, Bud, how you doing?

- Good, how are you?

- Hello.

- Ed Harris, Bud.

- Yes, Ed.

- [Ed] Well, we listened to Mr. Lee talk there.

The team he's gonna be playing when he comes up was gonna be August 2nd as far as we know right now.

And that's the Eastern Maine Amateur Baseball League.

- [Bill] Oh really?

- [Ed] Yeah, I sponsor and manage the Molunkus Travelers in that league.

- The Molunkus Travelers.

- The Molunkus Travelers, yep.

- You've been plunked in Molunkus?

- [Ed] Not yet, Bill.

- Plunk you in the ribses.

- No, but.

- No?

- [Ed] You may not remember, but a couple years ago, son of mine played against you when you was playing for Moncton, he played for Woodstock.

He hit a home run off you up there.

- In Woodstock?

- Yeah.

- Really?

- He was a catcher.

You beat him two to one.

- Well, he got the only run off me, congratulations.

- [Ed] And I think he said that you hit a home run for Moncton too but.

What I wanted to say is-- - I remember that ball game.

I enticed the guy from third to try at second.

I was at second base trying to get him to pick me off.

He tried to pick me off, threw the ball in center field and we had the winning run at third base.

And the winning run from third came in.

I said, "I knew you shouldn't have tried "to pick me off at second."

- [Bud] Ed, we got another call.

- Anyway, I don't think we're playing on that.

I think we're playing on this, sorry, it's not the second.

It's the eighth.

- The eighth, okay.

- Okay, that's what it is.

- Good enough.

- [Bud] All right, where are you calling from?

- [Caller] Yes, from Biddeford Maine.

- [Bill] Biddeford, I know where that is.

- [Caller] How you doing?

Hey Bud, I love your show, keep up the good work.

Listen, I got a question for Bill.

Bill, I watched you pitch a lot, okay?

But I wanna know about one of your teammates, if you don't mind.

Jim Rice.

Was he as physically imposing as everybody thought he was?

Like I've heard stories of when he came through a door, he really filled up the door frame well.

And if you did have a chance to pitch against Mr. Rice, what would you think of him being a pitcher?

- Just throw it in the dirt, he'd hack at it.

Swung a lot of bad pitches and couldn't pull the ball.

You know, he hit the ball away from him real good.

You could, he's kinda like Mo Vaughn.

You could throw the ball by him inside.

When he was younger, he was quick, but after he hurt his knee, he couldn't turn on the ball.

And I'm a carpenter now, and he wouldn't scare me if he filled up the frame.

- [Caller] Yeah, but Bill-- Go ahead.

- Huh?

- [Caller] For 10 years the man was imposing.

I mean, he was probably one of the best home run RBI man in the business, I mean.

- He sure was, he sure was.

- [Caller] He was imposing, I mean.

- Oh, I'm not saying anything bad against him except you know, I didn't get along with him, but I'm not saying.

He could have been great.

I mean, he was great.

He played good defense behind me.

He did everything that, I mean, he played well behind me.

You know, he liked me.

I still like Jim Rice and everything, but he had a surly manner that kind of got him upset.

And once his salary got up to the big bucks, and he started kind of waning, what happened because of the new market scale in baseball, they just get rid of you now.

(fingers snapping) They don't drop your salary because you complain, and you have your agent and you call discrimination or whatever you call it, you know, age discrimination.

- All right, Bill, we have another one.

- Thanks a lot, Bill.

- Yeah, you know.

- Hello.

- He's all right.

- Yes, Bill.

- Where you calling from?

- From Lyman.

- From where?

- [Caller] Yeah, I was wondering, are you gonna be able to get Bernie Carbo on your team, on your Gray Sox?

- Bernie Carbo's playing.

- Oh, he is?

- Let's put it this way.

He's gonna go out in the outfield, but the guy tends to kill grass when he's out there.

I might play the outfield, and I'll let him hit.

He's still a character, and he's in good shape.

He's quit drinking.

He's really turned over a new leaf.

He married a girl that looks like Blaze Starr.

So he has got his hands full.

- [Caller] What about the rooster?

- The rooster is coaching second base for the Red Sox if you ever watch the TV.

- [Caller] Oh, I didn't know, okay.

- All right.

- What about Jo Jo White?

Oh, that's the wrong game, sorry.

- Jo Jo White, yeah, Jo Jo White's coming up with us too.

We're bringing his bone spurs along in a separate bus.

(men laugh) - Come in, where are you calling from?

- Bangor.

- Bangor, all right.

- [Caller] I'd like to ask Mr. Lee how many games he won for Boston and how tall he is.

- [Bud] Bill, how tall are you?

What you want on the record?

- Let me look.

No, I'm six foot three.

I weigh 225 pounds, I'm 10 pounds overweight.

I won 97 or 94 games, lost 56 or something like that.

I had a pretty good record for the Red Sox.

I would've had a better record if my arm wasn't broken in '76.

- [Caller] Well, I always enjoyed watching you pitch.

Thank you.

- Well, thank you, I enjoyed pitching there.

- Come in, hello?

- Hello.

- Yes?

- [Bill] Where are you calling from?

Space, the final frontier.

- Space.

(men laugh) All right, we'll take this call.

Where are you calling from?

- [Caller] Yes, Moncton, New Brunswick.

- Moncton, Mew Brunswick.

- Howdy.

- [John] How are you doing, Bill?

- Who's this?

- [John] John McDonald from Moncton, New Brunswick.

- Hiya, John McDonald, I didn't play with you.

- [John] No, you played with the Moncton Mets.

- Yeah.

- [John] And we really enjoyed you down here.

- I thought Ross Kidney was gonna be calling me.

Or Brenda Kidney.

- [John] No, I used to watch you playing and we enjoyed you and your antics.

- Well, thank you.

- [John] Some of us were saying down here as they were in Montreal and everything else.

- Heck, I had a good year there once.

I had an ERA of 0.56, me and Rheal Cormier, we were good.

- [John] Yes, I know.

Rheal credits some of his major league... - I bet he didn't credit his last game to me.

- [John] No, I guess he's not, but he'll be back-- - Boy, he got lit up.

Second time around, you gotta change your stuff.

You gotta be able to trick guys.

And he went out there and someone just pounded his ears back, but you gotta learn to come back from that.

- [John] Yeah, he will, there's no doubt.

I mean.

- All right, we got another questioner on the line.

- Take care.

- Okay.

- Hello, where are you calling from?

- [Man] Calling from Brewer.

- From Brewer, all right.

- Canusa Games.

- [Caller] Yeah, just wanted to say hi to Bill.

I used to watch him in the bleachers a lot, and met him one time in No Name Restaurant.

- Really?

- In Boston.

- That's a good pace for fish.

- [Caller] Yeah, it sure is, good place.

Two quick questions.

One, I'd like to know if you'd ever like to be major league manager for a ball club someday.

And two, what would it take to get you to make a personal appearance somewhere?

- All you gotta do is find me.

- [Caller] Okay, how do I find you?

- Craftsbury, Vermont.

- Okay.

- I'm in the book.

- Okay.

- And as far as, what was the first que... Oh, be a major league manager?

- [Caller] Yes.

- I would love to manage the Red Sox or the Expos, especially the Red Sox, but they don't tend to hire pitchers to do jobs around there.

- [Caller] When I buy the Red Sox-- - You got a catcher with bad fingers that's a general manager.

Right?

- Right.

- And you got a whole bunch of guys that are hitters and stuff around there, and they just don't seem to hire pitchers in that organization.

- They're pretty fleet of foot too.

- And they're pretty fleet of foot.

We may have good pitching and good defense, which is something Boston had never seen before.

- When I buy-- - The fans wouldn't show up.

- [Bud] When you buy the Red Sox, tell me about it.

- [Caller] When I buy the Red Sox, Bill, you'll be the manager.

- Well, thank you, I would appreciate it.

I learned from the best.

- Come in, where are you calling from?

- Hello?

- Hello.

- [Caller] Hi, how are you today?

- Good, where are you calling from?

- Winterport.

- All right, good.

- [Caller] Yeah, Bill, how are you?

- I'm great, thank you.

- [Caller] My question is, well, first of all, just a little statement.

I went to school actually a little behind, but with Bob Montgomery, same high school he went to.

- Really?

- Yes.

Down in Nashville, Tennessee.

- Sure, that's where he's from.

- [Caller] Yeah, and anyway, what I'm trying to do now.

- He didn't like to catch then, did he?

I bet he just wanted to hit.

- [Caller] Probably.

(laughs) But anyway, what I'm trying to do is to get into baseball announcement.

Is there any maybe tip you could give me, so I could follow in his footsteps maybe?

- You gotta donate your own time.

You gotta find a place and send in your play by play of high school games and college games, and work your way up the ladder and do a lot of sweat equity.

- [Caller] Well, I've done that.

I'm going to the New England School of Broadcasting.

- Well, you're working your way up.

Don't be in a hurry and go down to Red Barber's door in Tallahassee and genuflect on his first step and have him come out and bless you.

And if he blesses you right, maybe things will-- - You are made.

- You are made.

- [Caller] Well, hopefully when you come up here for that ball game, I'll get to see you and talk to you then.

- Well, I'm telling you, you got that Southern accent, and you're living on the Maine coast, huh?

- Yeah.

- You're a lucky guy.

- Have a good one.

- Come in.

Where are you calling from?

- Girls must love him.

(chuckles) - Hello?

- [Caller] Hi, I'm calling from Bangor.

- Yes, sir.

- [Caller] Hi Bill, I met you earlier today at the convenience store in Bangor that you bought gas at.

- Right.

- [Caller] And I just want to invite you back tomorrow, and I'll buy you a coffee and a donut.

- Well, I appreciate that, but I'm heading outta town.

And I only bought half a tank of gas, I'll take that too.

No, I'm just kidding.

I'll see you.

Charge it to CK.

- Okay.

- Okay?

- All right.

- I know him well, he's a personal friend of mine.

- Hello, come in.

- [Caller] Hi, I'm calling from Portland.

- Yes, sir.

- [Caller] Bill, I was listening to you a couple of weeks ago on the radio, believe you were out in San Francisco.

- Yes, I was.

- [Caller] And you mentioned a work by, I believe it was Buckminster Fuller.

- Buckminster Fuller.

- [Caller] What was the title of that book?

I'm very interested in reading it.

- Operating Manual for Spaceship Earth.

- [Caller] That's what I thought it was, I wrote it down.

- Just think about it like this.

- [Caller] I was on my way driving up to-- - You got the Earth right here, and you put your hand on Madagascar and you woom!

You throw it back into fourth.

And then you're driving along through Earth.

You're doing 55 miles per second.

Hit the equator, and all of a sudden you're tilting your axis 23.

In other words, you learn how the Earth works in the scheme of things, and once you learn that, it's like Archimedes said.

You give me a lever and a fulcrum and a place to stand, I can move the Earth.

Trouble is, we couldn't find a place for him to stand.

- How have things been in space of late?

(chuckles) - Well, we're all traveling, you have to realize.

See, that's the concept.

We are all, as we are sitting here right here, thank God we are rotating on our axis.

And thank God we are tilting, or we wouldn't have change of seasons.

We're not doing real, God's not doing a good job this year because we're a little late and salmon haven't come up, but we're traveling like this.

And once you read Buckminster Fuller, and you understand Buckminster Fuller, H. Ross Perot has to read Buckminster Fuller.

And the first one who reads it first, I will vote for Perot, Clinton or Bush if all of 'em read that book.

Whoever reads it first, can understand it and sees the light, and not the light from the nightlight in the bathroom.

You know, sees the real light.

Then I will vote for him and support him as President of the United States.

- Come on, all right.

Your question.

- That's a good book.

It's Operating Manual, Spaceship Earth.

- Thank you.

- You bet.

- Your question.

- Yes, sir.

- Yes, sir.

- How you doing, Bill?

- Where you calling him from?

- [Caller] I'm calling from Old Town, Maine.

- All right, good.

Pretty good town.

- How's your canoe?

- [Caller] My canoe.

Bill, now you said you'd like to manage the Red Sox, right?

- Yes.

- Okay.

Now if I managed the Red Sox, my first move would to put to put Jack Clark on the bench.

How about your move?

- No kidding.

- We'd put him on a plane, we'll do better than that.

- [Caller] Yeah.

Now wouldn't you agree with that?

- I would agree with that in a heartbeat.

- [Caller] The guy comes up in clutch situations either strikes out or grounds out.

- Hey, he's-- - How about the mighty Joe Young?

Would you put him on a plane?

- [Caller] Joe, who?

(laughs) - We would, I would, yeah.

We're talking about, you know, the guy who's got...

The difference between Matt Young and Bill Lee.

Someone said, "What's the difference?"

I said, "You see that mirror over there?"

I said, "I can hit that mirror and won't break it.

"Matt Young can't hit that mirror."

But no, I would bring up Cerruti.

- [Caller] Yeah.

- I would sit Matt Young down for a while until he got his control.

I would run Matt Young six miles every day.

- [Caller] There's nothing wrong with the pitching staff though, is there?

- No, well, the pitching staff has done remarkably well.

And the hitters, they're just slow, and they-- - Matt Young can't run six miles.

- That's true, he can't run six miles.

- There's no way in the world, anymore than I can.

- First thing we would do, we would've, two years ago, we would've traded-- - Cut his check and send him on the road.

- We would've traded Boggs for Joe Carter straight up.

- Oh baby.

- Ooh.

- Put Cooper at third.

- Would you make that deal?

- [Caller] That wouldn't be a bad idea, yeah.

- We had that deal made.

You know another deal we had?

We had a kid named Avery they wanted.

The Red Sox could have got Avery.

- From Atlanta.

- From Atlanta.

- How about a guy named Brady Anderson?

- Oh yeah, Brady Anderson learned about lifting weights.

Arnold Schwarzenegger came and visited him in the off season.

Now he has 14 home runs for Baltimore.

And how about the guy in Houston?

- Houston, on first base.

- On first base.

Rookie of the Year.

- All right, your question, let's go.

- [Bill] Shoot the general manager.

- Your question, where are you calling from?

- Bucksport.

- Bucksport, yes, sir.

- [Caller] I was wondering if Mr. Lee had any idea why that when Boston gets rid of pitchers they tend to pitch a lot better.

- Well.

- AKA, you know-- - There's two reasons.

I don't think the management handles pitchers real well up there.

I think they get a shorthand of the stick.

And second, once you leave Fenway Park, everywhere is easier to pitch.

And once you've done your penance at Fenway Park, you go to another park, you breathe a lot easier.

You go, "Oh, I'm out of Fenway Park."

You know, you're relaxed and you throw better.

They bring pitchers up too fast in Boston.

They throw 'em to the wolves right away.

They did that with Hurst, and Hurst was benched.

And Zimmer said he had no guts and he couldn't pitch.

Now he is premier left hander in the National League.

He had a guy named Tudor, he had a guy named Ojeda.

He had a guy named Lee who did a pretty good job for him, and they got rid of me because I spoke my mind.

You know, they don't treat pitchers with a great... Look at Roger Moret.

- You have a call from VZ.

- I have a call from VZ.

- VZ, yes.

- Where do you get all this?

You get all... You're a mind reader.

- [Spencer] Hi, hi kid, you know me.

- Hello.

- Spencer.

- Hiya.

- I'm thinking you met Spencer at the-- - I sure did.

- Yeah, you sure do.

- We didn't wet any flies, but we wetted our whistle.

- [Spencer] You, copy.

(laughs) How you doing?

- [Bill] What's your question, Spencer?

- Well, I wanted to find out how you think about Ted Williams?

- What do you think about Ted Williams?

- I think Ted Williams is a character.

And I think he's the luckiest guy in the world to have that body and the quickest swing he had.

The greatest eyes that was ever blessed a guy.

He was the best fighter pilot with the exception of Yeager.

He was blessed with remarkable tools, and he was the best, by far the best ball player that ever played the game.

Statistically, if he had played those extra five years, he would've surpassed all the records, you know?

And I like him when he has a little branch water and stuff.

He can fling a pu pu platter across the table and crack 'em against.

He's a, you know, he's a one of a kind, I'll tell you, John Wayne spent a whole career trying to imitate Ted Williams.

- [Spencer] I love him.

- Yeah, good luck to you.

- All right, Spencer.

- Thank you.

- Next call, where are you calling from?

- I'm calling from Bangor.

- All right.

- [caller] And I'm a displaced Vermonter, fellow Vermonter.

- Well, thank you.

- Yeah.

Actually, Bill, I played in a 4th of July game against, or with you about three years ago in-- - Saxon River.

- Saxon River, that's right.

- Right, we beat Brattleboro.

- [Caller] Yeah, you had a clutch double.

- [Bud] What a big league, Saxon and Brattleboro.

- Yeah, it was a big game, we were the state champs.

The team I played for used to be, right?

- [Caller] Yeah, that's right.

Yeah, anyways, I was just curious what you thought of Carlton Fisk.

- Carlton Fisk, he was like all those guys born along the Connecticut River.

He was like, his mother must have gone out and dipped him in the Connecticut River up to his ankles.

And he's just, that's the only thing that's given him trouble this year.

He's like Achilles.

He is the consummate New Englander.

Stick-to-it-iveness, hardworking.

And he would never have been as great as he was in Chicago if he hadn't have, every time the ball came in, it didn't look like Haywood Sullivan's head.

And every time he sees it, it gets bigger and bigger and bigger, and he waits and just rips it.

And look at all the home runs he's hit against the Red Sox.

He's an amazing ball player, but you'll think about it.

He's caught more games for Chicago.

He's hit more home runs for Chicago, but he played his best years for Boston, and he should be the manager of the Red Sox right now.

Player manager.

- All right, come in with your call.

Where are you calling from?

- Bangor.

- Yes, sir.

- [Caller] Well, I just wanna say, Bud, that you know how to fill up a salmon boat.

I've seen you a few times out there.

- Oh, is that right, huh?

A smart guy.

Go ahead, what's your question?

- [Caller] Well, I just wanna tell Bill, first of all, he was probably the second best lefthanded pitcher that I ever saw in the Red Sox uniform.

- Who was the best?

- [Caller] Well, I think Bruce Hurst probably was the best until the Boston fans got the best of him.

- Well, Hurst won one less game than I did in a Boston uniform.

- That's right.

- And I thank him every day he left.

And went to that great St. George, Utah, where the air is fresh and full of uranium.

And now he's playing in San Diego and who cares?

- He's lost out there.

- Right.

- He won five in a row, who cares?

- Come in with your call, where are you calling from?

- Where are you from?

- Hello?

- [Caller] West Tremont.

- West Tremont.

- Yep.

One comment, Mr. Lee, you're greatly appreciated in this area.

You're one of the most colorful and interesting baseball people in New England.

And I have just one question.

I think that the Red Sox gave up on Eckersley too quick.

Why didn't they make him a relief pitcher instead of trading him?

- Well, they don't know how to handle people.

His wife saved his career.

She was the chief of police's daughter, I believe.

She videotaped him after he got drunk on New Year's Eve.

Showed him the videotape and he hasn't had a drink since.

That's what changed Eckersley's career.

Red Sox couldn't handle him.

They don't know really how to handle players.

There's tons of 'em, they can get 'em all over the place.

- You know, when Eck was there and we had the Buffalo heads, that was the delegation.

- Oh, we had tons of 'em, you're right.

We had Eckersley, me, all those guys down the line.

We weren't good.

If you treated us bad, we went out and partied a little harder, you know?

And we were hurting ourselves and you know.

But Eckersley, you look at his statistics.

I mean, what a great guy, he's a-- - Come in with your call, where are you calling from?

- South Portland.

- South Portland, yes, sir.

- Bill.

- Yeah.

- [Caller] What do you think about Roger Clemens?

Is he the best pitcher you've seen?

- Roger Clemons is a great pitcher.

He doesn't have a lot of heart.

He doesn't win big games at the end of the season.

And he took himself out of a ball game with a one, nothing lead against Oakland last year, the first game of the series.

And Anderson came in and they lost it.

And then they lost the next three in a row.

You know, day in and day out, he's a horse.

He is a horse, but he hasn't proven it to me that he should, with his ability and with this staff, if they get into a playoff situation, he's gotta win the first game.

He's gotta come back and win the fourth game, and he's gotta win the seventh game.

When he does that, I will change my opinion of the big guy.

He's a great, got great stuff and everything else, but I've seen him in big games, and he hasn't done it.

Hadn't beat Toronto in the clutch.

- [Caller] He will this year.

- Good.

- Come in with your call, where are you calling from?

- North Windham.

- North Windham, yes, sir?

- [Caller] Well, Bill, I'd like to make a small comment then a quick question.

First of all, I watched you pitch many times down at Fenway Park, and I have to admire your guts and your determination.

I mean, I know that means a lot, but the question I wanna ask you is all the time you've been playing baseball, who do you think is the toughest, gutsiest, fairest, you know, hardworking everyday ball player that you ever played with or against?

Bill, tell me.

- Wow.

I thought you were gonna comment in on my shirt.

- Tough question.

- Where did you get that shirt?

I got it from Eddie Haskell from the Leave It To Beaver show.

- Very nice.

- Yeah.

I...

The toughest, gutsiest, hardest-nosed player I ever played against and one of the meanest individuals and I didn't like him a bit was Thurman Munson.

- [Caller] Really?

- Thurman Munson was the hardest-nosed, toughest, day in, day out.

Carlton Fisk was the other guy that I think played hurt, was tough, mean, you know.

And as far as hardworking and gutsy ball player, I've played with a lot of 'em, you know.

No one more than that Andre Dawson, another guy.

- The Hawk.

- The Hawk.

Played on bad knees on AstroTurf.

And the day he went to Chicago, I said, "You did the right thing.

"You're gonna add years to your career," and it certainly has.

And he got to play in the pennant there for a while.

- But he's just allowed incidentally to have knee operations.

- [Caller] Wouldn't he look nice in a Red Sox uniform?

- He sure would look nice, Andrew Dawson.

- Wouldn't he?

- Oh yeah, he's a gutsy-- - He would have about four years ago.

- His legs are as old as the wind though.

- [Caller] Sure, sure.

- Too bad, his legs, his knees are as old as Bud's.

- [Caller] That's what happens when we get old.

- That's exactly right.

- [Caller] That's what happens when we get old, Bill, you-- - That's what happens when we get old.

- Well, like us, we're drinking black coffee.

He's drinking water, he's good.

- Come in with-- - Thanks, Bill.

- My knees are going fast, yep.

- Come in with your call, where are you calling from?

- [Caller] Calling from Charlottetown, Prince Edward Island in Canada.

- Charlottetown, Prince Edward Island.

- [Bill] I played there against the Generals.

- [Caller] Yeah, we saw you play a couple of times.

When I was a kid, I spent my summers in Malden, just north of Boston there, when I was growing up.

And I really, really enjoyed watching you play.

- Well, thank you.

- [Caller] I'm watching the show now for about 20 minutes, and no one's mentioned Yastrzemski, quite a ball player.

Favorite of mine.

A couple of comments on him.

And I really concur with your remarks about Jack Clark.

He's gotta go.

And who would be your pick to manage the Sox now?

- Besides myself?

- Besides yourself, yeah.

- Johnny Pesky.

Johnny Pesky 'cause he's happy, he is lovable, and it's his time.

You know, he'll lead 'em from the doldrums.

They'll come on and win it for him.

And then he can retire and be happy as a lark.

- There's no more fun in those dressing rooms.

- You're right.

- There are no laughs.

- [Bill] None.

- There used to be gags and everybody was a trickster and you know, Tiant would come in there.

- Oh, he'd keep you laughing all game long, all the time.

You know, there's no levity in the situation.

And Yastrzemski was kind of a sour puss.

Even though you liked him, and he was a great guy.

He was the world's worst dresser.

Wore the same raincoat all the time.

And we would constantly throw it away.

And he'd always fish it out of the trash bin.

And we would throw it away, and he'd fish it back.

He dressed like Colombo, you know?

And he was the world's worst bridge player, but he was a hard worker, and he was a tough guy.

And by the way, have you had a late spring in PEI?

- [Caller] Yeah, real late.

It's been a tough one.

It's going down to about three degree Celsius here tonight.

- Wow.

- Wow.

- [caller] And yeah, we've had a late spring.

- Gonna have a frost, aren't you?

- [Caller] Yeah, yeah, frost warning tonight.

And it's been a real late.

- Can you believe this, June 4th?

- [Caller] It's beautiful up here, beautiful up here.

And one final comment.

- Mount Pinatubo.

- [Caller] Bill Lee and the Sox have a lot of fans in PEI.

- Well, thank you very much.

I got a lot of fans in Tignish.

(laughs) - [Caller] Good spot.

(laughs) - Come in with your call, where are you calling from?

- Calling from Bangor.

- Yes, sir.

- [Lenny] Hi Bill, it's Lenny Silver calling from Telco Communications.

I play left field for you.

- Oh, you sure do.

- [Lenny] How are you?

- What, you're up here tonight?

- [Lenny] I'm up here trying to get us some games.

- Well, good.

- How you been?

- I'm doing fine.

- [Bud] What is this, a neighborhood match or what?

- Oh, I'm playing with him this, if you're healthy, I'm playing with him tomorrow night down in Millis, Mass.

- Are you?

- Yeah, but where are you staying?

- [Lenny] I'm right at the Red Carpet Inn in Bangor.

- Yeah, I'll give you a call after the show.

- [Lenny] All right.

- And we'll find out what we're gonna do strategy wise of playing up here.

Well, we're gonna play Stephen King on his field, but we're gonna play hardball.

- That's fine.

- Is that fine?

- Oh, you know me.

- Okay, I know you.

- [Lenny] That Moncton caller that called before, we should get, remember I played for Alleys up there.

Rhode Island Alleys.

- Yeah.

- [Lenny] And we had some great baseball games up there.

- All right, you guys, wait a minute.

Get on the telephone.

- [Lenny] I just wanted to say hi.

- Yeah.

- All right.

- [Lenny] Bill, give me a call later.

We'll go have a cup of coffee.

- Okay.

- Take it easy, bye.

- Come in, where are you calling from?

- Waterville.

- Waterville, yes, sir.

- [Bill] I haven't been to Waterville.

Howdy.

- Mr. Lee.

- Yeah.

- [Caller] Baseball misses characters like you.

I appreciate when you pitched.

- Well, thank you.

I just, I wasn't a character, I just played hard and maybe they made me into a character, but I haven't changed from the days in little league, you know?

I played with Tim Foley.

Remember Tim Foley?

- Mm-hmm.

- And he was crazy, I was one of the saner guys.

He'd strike out, he'd sleep at second base 'cause he was afraid his dad would beat him, you know?

- [Caller] I just, you just gave it everything you had all the time, that's why I appreciate it.

- Well, thank you.

- [Caller] One question, what do you think?

One of my other favorites, Rick Burleson.

What do you think of him as playing short stop?

- Tough, tough cookie.

- Gave you a day's work every ballgame.

- [Caller] Yes, yeah, that's what, well.

- He threw too hard though.

He kept winding up, throwing too hard.

I says, "Rick, save your arm.

"You only got one arm, you know?"

And eventually, threw it out out there.

And he just did everything, he does everything too intense.

- [Caller] Well, how do you think the Red Sox when they treated him, the way they released him and he went to the Angels, and the Angels brought him back and let him recuperate.

And he played a couple more seasons with 'em.

I think they did more for him mentally wise, far as-- - The Red Sox hated-- - Appreciating him.

- Yeah.

The Red Sox Hated Burleson, they hated Fisk.

They hated Lynn.

They hated all the guys that had Kapstein as their agent back in that time.

See, the party line of all the owners was don't sign your own free agents.

Let 'em go, let 'em go.

They'll never get more on the free market.

And then as soon as they let 'em go, every owner that had deep pockets would go, eh, the hell with the other owners, I'm gonna give him...

I'm gonna buy this guy for this amount money.

I'm gonna buy this guy.

And all of a sudden, prices escalate, and they blame it on Burleson.

They say, "Damn, Burleson.

"He goes and free agent, and he goes out there.

"We're gonna hate him and stuff."

But they brought him back as a coach.

They brought Zimmer back as a coach.

They love those tough-nosed little leprechauns.

- [Caller] He gave it 110% every time he played.

- Next client please, where are you calling from?

Hello?

- Hello.

- Yes, sir, where are you calling from?

- [Caller] I'm calling from East Sullivan.

- East Sullivan, all right, beautiful place.

- [Caller] Well, it's not bad.

- That near Haywood, is it?

- Yeah, down near Haywood.

I like talking to that boy.

Hey, you talked about Andre Dawson and his old legs.

I'm surprised that the Red Sox don't want to pick him up 'cause they never seem to want to get any base stealers.

- I tell you, he's got the sorest legs, and he'd still be one of the fastest guys in the Red Sox organization.

They get 'em in that organization, and they feed 'em slow pills.

They give it to 'em down there.

- I guess you're right.

- I'm telling you.

They put some gypsum in with their vitamin C or something.

I don't know what they put in it.

They all turn into like Lot's wife.

Pillars of stone when they get into the organization.

- Where are you calling from?

- Hello?

- Hi, Bill.

- Yeah.

- Calling from Windham.

- All right, Windham.

- [Caller] I wanna know if Bill can reflect on his best moments in the Sox uniform.

Talking about Thurman Munson and stuff.

I remember a brawl way back when.

- Yeah, he can too.

He come up with a bum shoulder.

- [Caller] Yeah.

- Well, I got beat up that game, '76.

First game against the Yankees after we had beat 'em in '75, and they had changed managers from Lot's wife, which was Bill Virdon to a little pugnacious son of a gun named Billy Martin.

And we got in a big fight and I hurt my arm.

And it never really healed properly after that.

But I still continued to pitch as hard as I could.

I just, I actually had a better sinker on days.

I had a better slow curve.

I had to have a better slow curve.

I lost my hard-breaking curve ball.

And you know, but I was smarter.

An injured beaver is a smart beaver.

He avoids a lot of traps.

The Indians have a high respect for the injured animal because they have to use their smarts and guile to get by.

And that's what I became.

I became a lame beaver, and I worked hard.

But my best moment in a Red Sox uniform would have to be the first day I ever got to put it on because those were good flannels, nice polish.

They weren't the double knits.

You know, I looked good.

I got, Yastrzemski was over here.

Tony Conigliaro was in his prime.

You know, Rico Petrocelli was young.

Mike Andrews was still playing and you know, it was a nice time to come up in the late '60s.

And you know, and when I got in that Red Sox uniform, I wasn't in a trench over in Vietnam, and that was the highlight of my life.

And that's why I played hard because I didn't want to go to 'Nam.

You know, and I was blessed, I was lucky.

I had a low number.

I was drafted and I got into a reserve unit.

And the Red Sox for six years, I played hard.

It kept me out of the army, the regular army, you know.

And I didn't have to get my rear end shot off.

So it was a, the late '60s, early '70s.

You know, you ever watch that show on TV called, oh, whatever it is.

I can't think of it now.

(fingers snapping) - Deer Isle is waiting to talk to you.

Come in, Deer isle.

Hello?

- Oh, hi, Bill.

- Lot of people died in the Civil War in Deer Isle.

- They sure did.

- Yeah.

- [Caller] First I have a question, but I also wanna thank you, Bill, for your insights into the Red Sox and professional baseball.

It's been fascinating tonight.

- Well, thank you very much.

- [Caller] Okay, the question I have is I know how I felt as a fan when the Red Sox lost to the Mets a few years ago in the World Series, but as a former player, how did you feel at the time?

And it seemed like the Red Sox had it, but they just lost it.

How did you feel?

- We had just won one of our last playoff games for the Moncton Mets.

We were sitting in a bar up there, our whole team.

And I remember we were sitting there gathered around the TV, and they brought in Ciraldi and he had Carter zero and two.

And he made a bad pitch and Carter got a base hit.

Then he had the next guy zero and two, and made a bad pitch.

And he just was brain dead out there.

And all of a sudden they bring in Stanley, and then he throws the ball and Getman goes over, and I'm going, "Holy cow, here they go again."

And I'm sitting there and then that ball went through Buckner's legs.

And we were just talking the other day.

He was down in Phoenix, Arizona, and he got despondent and he jumped out in the street, tried to commit suicide, jumped in front of a bus, but it went between his legs.

- [Caller] Yeah.

Oh, I got it, okay.

- You got it.

Come in with your call.

Come in with your call.

- Fort Fairfield.

- Fort Fairfield, yes, sir.

- Hi, Bud.

- How are ya?

- Good, good.

- Hi, Bill.

- Howdy.

- [Caller] Bill, you've had a lot of easy pitches to handle tonight and I just wanted to comment on your pitch to Perez in '75.

- Right.

- [Caller] I thought it was a dreadful mistake.

Could you do defend it?

Hell, no.

Why should I defend a bad pitch?

I made a bad pitch, but then I kept going.

You know, life is like that.

What happened on the pitch?

Before the hitter, before Perez.

Do you know?

No, I don't.

Johnny Bench hit a two hopper to Burleson.

Burleson threw it to Doyle.

Doyle jumped over the bag and threw it in the dugout.

Yastrzemski didn't make the play.

That would've been the third out of the inning.

Perez doesn't even come up.

I don't have to face him until the lead off hitter the next inning.

- Thank you, Bill.

- People don't remember that.

They only remember the bad pitch I threw to Perez, but everything in life it's a context.

What happened in the third inning?

We had runners at second and third and nobody out.

I was the runner at third, I got a base hit to drive in a run.

I'm standing over there, and we got the top three hitters coming up, and we don't score another run.

We could have blown them out of the water.

And we would've had a six-run lead going into the fourth inning.

We didn't have a killer's instinct at the plate.

We hung on and we came back, but we didn't have the kind of club that could put people away.

And it was very, it shown up very distinctly in the seventh game.

We were content to just keep playing, but we didn't have that killer instinct.

And they didn't really either.

I pitched pretty good.

I got a blister on my thumb.

I had to come out the following inning.

I couldn't throw strikes.

But you know.

We had Willoughby.

Willoughby hasn't given up a run in a world series game to this day.

And they pitch it for Willoughby with two outs.

They brought in Cecil Cooper, swung a three high fastball.

See you later, goodbye Cece, Baltimore.

- [Caller] I always wanted to ask you, thank you.

- Yeah, well, that's it, you know, that's-- - Come in with your question.

- It was a bad pitch, a hanging curve ball.

- Hello?

- Hello.

- Yes.

- Curve ball right in front of your face.

(laughs) - [Caller] I'd like to make just one comment.

- Yes, Ma'am.

- [Caller] I miss watching Jim Rice play, and I would like to hear Bill Lee's comments on Jim Rice, and I'll hang up and let him answer.

- All right, dear.

Thank you.

- Okay.

- Jim Rice was one of the great all-time hitters of all time.

He could hit to all fields, he could hit with power.

He could run, he could do everything.

Everything came very easy to Jim Rice.

And he got very high, he got very fallutin'.

He made a lot of money, and then he got sloppy.

And he got old in his career, and they cut him loose for one reason, and that was because he wasn't really nice.

And if he had have been nicer to the people on the way up.

I was always told, be nice to the people on the way up because you're gonna see 'em again on the way down.

And what happened is when he got up here and his money was big, bingo, they cut him, and he fell very fast.

But now he's a hitting coach, and he's mellowed.

He's gotten much better, and he should have done those little things to stay around.

He's hall of fame material.

He should have been.

He was by far one of the great hitters of all time in all categories.

- For 10 years.

- For 10 years.

- 10 years, great record.

All right, we're down to a couple of minutes.

Your question.

Hello?

- Hello.

- Yes.

- [Caller] Yeah, I'd like Bill to explain his thoughts on the Red Sox getting rid of Bernie Carbo.

- I've already covered that.

They got rid of Carbo.

That was when I was on the strike day, or not the strike day, the day that I walked out and got mad at him and stuff.

And, hell, Bernie Carbo hit .310, had 25 home runs in 125 games for the Cincinnati Reds.

He made $9,000.

They offered him a $1000 raise for the next year.

Here he was Rookie of the Year or close to it in the National League, and he walked outta spring training.

He held out, they punished him.

He came back, had a terrible year.

They sent him to St. Louis.

And he's just always wanted to be wanted, and he never felt wanted in life.

He was always dealt.

And he always had that feeling.

And it was a sad, sad state of affairs.

He was a great hitter, and he had a lot of problems.

- Final question, where are you calling from?

- Etna.

- Etna, let's have it.

- Bill-- - How's the eruption?

- [Caller] Oh, we don't have a volcano here in Etna.

- [Bill] Oh, okay.

- [Caller] How do you think a minor league ball team would do here in Bangor?

- Minor league ball club with Stephen King's Field, they'd draw 1500 every game, but the problem is with minor league ball here is you're at the far end of the Earth.

Everyone's gotta come all the way from East-- - [Bud] What do you mean the Earth?

- You're at the Earth over here.

- [Bud] Come on, be kind.

- You gotta realize that people gotta drive all the way.

The other Eastern League clubs or rookie league clubs.

It's far away.

If the transportation, if you can get Northwest Airlines in here to fly people to all these minor league fields, Bangor would draw great.

You could play at Orono at the college field, but that's committed to a lot of other other events.

You'd have to have a field.

Stephen King's would have to add bleachers down the sides, and then you would draw 3000 every game.

It's a perfect place.

Logistically right now, with the prices, it's a bad place.

- Bill, we got 25 seconds.

- [Bill] Yeah, I'll be playing here anyway on August 9th.

You don't have to see anybody else.

- Listen, old friend, you've been a joy and a delight.

- Well, thank you.

- And enjoyed having you.

And we'll be looking forward to when you come with the Gray Sox or the Gray Beards.

Listen, that's our final program for the summer.

Wish you well.

Have a safe and a happy summer.

And perhaps this fall, we'll see you again.

Many, many, thanks for being our viewers and our friends.

We bid you, good night.

♪ From every green wood tree ♪ Val-deri, Val-dera ♪ Val-deri, Val-dera ♪ Val-deri, Val-dera ♪ Oh, may I go a-wandering until the day I die ♪ ♪ Oh, may I always laugh and sing ♪ ♪ Beneath God's clear blue sky ♪ Val-deri, Val-dera ♪ Val-deri, Val-dera, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha ♪ ♪ Val-dera ♪ Beneath God's clear blue sky (bright instrumental music, "The Happy Wanderer") ♪ Beneath God's clear blue sky